Properties of elysons and of the elysium

[tvf] "Note that I'm being somewhat devil's advocate here."

I have been assuming/hopeing you would take that role. Thanks.

LB

BTW, if anyone else sees a target worth taking a pot shot at, please do so.

Larry and Tom, very interesting discussion.

If elysium temperature, density and/or pressure is not constant, then we should consider that it may also have different states analogous to gas, liquid, and solid with different properties for each. The only wrinkle that I can think of is that unlike normal matter that we are familiar with elysium particles would be repulsive to each other and would be completely pervasive. Thus, I would suspect that the movements of individual elysium particles would be quite chaotic in the absence of other forces in opposition to their like-repulsion. If the elysium medium is not rigid, then differences in temperature will cause elysium to flow. If it is rigid, then temperature variations will result differences in density and pressure (and vise versa) and perhaps changes in state. If elysium exists in both rigid and liquid/gas like states, then waves may be either transverse or longitudinal.

Ahhh...deduction is such a good way to discover nature! NOT!

JR

Larry,

I think you are correct WRT sound waves, they are always longitudinal. They are a pressure wave initiated by a displacement along the axis of propagation.

Transverse waves are possible within any contiguous medium, but their energy is quickly disipated compared to longitudinal waves and their propagation speed is much slower. Its easy to see why this is so. Medium particles in a transverse wave will move perpendicular to the direction of propagation. The impulse required for the wave movement of a particle comes from the particle just above/below it pushing it up/down or repulsion force vector between the particle and the one behind it which has displaced upward/downward a moment before. The latter is what causes the transverse wave to propagate transversely at all and only a portion of the force vector is in the direction of propagation. Much of the energy of the wave is dissipated by the dampening action of all the particles above and below the particles participating in the wave motion. In longitudinal waves OTOH the particle movement is in the same direction as the propagation. Individual particles are able to transfer almost all the impulse energy directly to the particle in front of it. There is relatively very little particle movement before the impulse is passed to the next particle so the propagation speed is much higher.

All mediums that are dense enough so that wave impulses can be generated in the first place are able to propagate longitudinal waves. However, only mediums where the dominant force between particles is an inherent repulsive one (as opposed to the repulsion due to the medium's energetic particles colliding with each other as in a gas) can transverse waves propagate within.

Therefore, if light is a transverse wave then elysium must be dominated by the replusive forces between particles rather than the forces imparted by particle collisions. If light is a longitudinal wave, then that fact tells us much less about the nature of elysium.

My gut feeling FWIW is that light as transverse waves is inconsistent with the required properties of elysium, mainly fast wave propagation speed over very long distances and very many oscillations with low energy loss.

JR

JR,

Theoretical and empirical studies point to transverse body waves as the thing we call light. As Tom points out there are some who see evidence for a longitudinal "component" of light. In siesmology, surface waves (especially Rayliegh waves) are in fact a combination of longitudinal and transverse vibrations. Rayliegh waves are the slowest of the four wave types and they are dispersive, meaning that wave speed is a function of wave length. (Light is not dispersive in vacuuo, and neither are body waves in rock.) The amplitude of surface waves drops sharply as you move away from the surface, so they truely are a surface phenomenon.

Longitudinal body waves ought to exist in elysium, but most likely as a separate phenomenon in the same way that they are a separate phenomenon within Earth. But if they do exist in elysium they ought to be fairly easy to detect. And they ought to propagate about 2X faster than light (transverse waves) if the same speed relationship exists in elysium as in rock.

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Inter-particle repulsion does seem to be an important part of the picture. It's cool that someone else sees the importance of this.

Atoms in a normal matter solid are held together by the existence of inter-particle attraction, but they are also kept apart by inter-particle repulsion. At some distance a balance is reached and equilibrium sets in.

Elysons in elysium are held together by ... but I'm getting ahead of myself. Details are comming in a soon to be posted message, but the short version is that elysons reach an equilibrium distance from each other as well. And while they can move relative to each other (for example if some have been entrained by a moving bit of normal matter), they normally do not.

LB

A little bit of data to play with: